Gibson Kasha disaster

[peter.coombe]

A fellow has just dropped off an old Gibson Kasha braced guitar with some serious issues. He wants to know if I can fix it. I am tempted to tell him to take it back and buy a new guitar since the issues are pretty serious. However, it is worth asking you lot what you think and what I can do to fix it, and if it is worth fixing.

Issues
(1) Bridge has bellied up and the top looks like the waves of Bondi behind the bridge
(2) Top has folded a bit around the sound hole
(3) There is a twist in the neck
End result, not surprisingly, is the guitar is unplayable due to extremely high action.
What do ya think?

Pictures

[charangohabsburg]

For lowering the action you could try to file down the saddle...

That looks like a serious combination of an unknown number of problems, e.g. things (including bracing) coming apart at several places. I think fixing this would imply to take the box at least partially apart, probably completely re-brace the top, replace or fix the neck block, and who knows what else. I think such an endeavour is only worth the yet unknown effort if this, for some reason is a very special guitar. If the customer really wants to get it fixed I probably would suggest him to start the repair and going on step by step, with an open budget to be paid also step by step, and if he thinks that it would be too much he could say stop at any point and then leave the guitar in the condition it would be at that moment. Like this, his grandchildren would have the opportunity to throw some more money at it if the value of this thing will have gone up 50 years ahead... Your scenario (replacing the guitar and leave this one alone) makes more sense to me though.

Cheers,

[Trevor Gore]

Assuming nothing has actually let go on the inside....

...you could try one of those bridge doctor thingies, and jack the top more-or-less straight (over a few weeks). Given that the sound couldn't get much worse (no sound!), it's not a big risk or a big expense.

The neck twist is another matter. It could even have been intentional on those old Mark guitars. A pure twist will still allow straight individual string lies, so with a bit of judicious use of the truss rod you may be able to get to that. Any fret dressing will need to be on a per string basis.

If you can pull off a fix with just that, the guy will think you're a magician and you should charge him accordingly (so you can pay my normal consulting fee ). If it doesn't work, charge him cost and show him where the dumpster is.

[Mark McLean]

Peter
The thing is probably un-fixable. If the owner really wants to make the best of it because of sentimental attachment then a Bridge Doctor is the way to go. They are pretty good at rescuing a guitar with an inadequately braced and a badly bellied top. There is no saddle left and no break angle at all. I imagine it sounds pretty poor! A BD will pull the top down and you can then replace the saddle and get it working again. It costs about 20 bucks from Stew Mac and you can install it in half an hour. The skewed neck is a whole different problem. Can you ignore it? If not it needs the frets removed and the board planed. Or else it is a wall hanging, or firewood.

[peter.coombe]

For lowering the action you could try to file down the saddle.

Ho, Ho very funny!!

I was thinking along the lines of what Trevor said. Bridge doctor, tweek the truss rod and hope to get away with the neck twist. Fixing the neck twist properly is likely to take a fair bit of time and is probably not worth the cost to the customer. If I just do that it then should be playable and I get to be the local guitar repair hero. It does have quite a nice EIR back so may be worth resurrecting. Not sure I want too many more dead guitars though.

Peter

[Kim]

Good call, do a DIY bridge Dr and hand it back Peter. To try doing anything else on that guitar is to invite trouble and possible finger pointing if it doesn't come together within budget. I.E. anything is fixable if you throw enough time and money at it. You and the client will need plenty of both, your client more of the later if you were to invest more of the former pulling the top.

Cheers

Kim

[jayluthier]

run away, run away

[woodrat]

run away, run away

...but administer thine Holy Hand Grenade first!....and dont forget to count correctly...thats important!




John

[EricDownunder]

I recently had the same problem on my old Gianini, I correctled the problem by first removing the strings, suporting the inside of the guitar from the soundhole to behind the the bridge but not all the way to the heal, next step was to apply moisture to the inside of the guitar with a wet rag then gently applying heat with a hot air gun to the affected area on the outside being very carefull not to overheat the top finish (I stopped when it went a little cloudy it came back perfectly clear when cooled), while still warm I used some cotton cloth then a good solid blocks inside and out clamping overnight. Second night I squesed in two new braces next to the ones that were suspect, left the braces clamed for a few days. Put in a new ivory bridge I had lying around as the original had been mucked around with put new strings on yhe old girl and hey presto a perfectly tuned yippy-stick with great action. This guitar has came back to life after over 40 years and someone here plays it every day now as it sounds fantastic. Give yours a go you have nothing to lose, your customer could be overwhelmed if it all goes well like mine.

[simso]

Its not too bad

The serations across the back can come good if you can get the water content right in the wood

The lift of the bridge is either going to need some internal bracing to fix or fitment of a bridge doctor

The neck twist, is a simple heat and clamp.

The high action will probably be fixed by the bridge doctor, but if not, some sanding of the saddle and or bridge itself will rectify this.

[kiwigeo]

Is this guitar a 1970's mark series Gibson?

Ok yes it is......it pays to read all the posts in the thread

[peter.coombe]

Well after removing the strings and poking around inside, it doesn't look as bad as first thought. Can't find anything loose inside and the neck is not as twisted as it looks. The problem with the neck is mostly a nut that is more than twice as high on one side as the other, and frets filed so low on one side as to be almost flush with the fretboard. So the twist is mostly an illusion, some other "repair" person has been at this guitar before me. Should be fixable with a new nut and refret to fix the neck, and bridge doctor to fix the bridge belly up. Don't know if the customer will pay the cost of this just yet.

Peter

[Paul B]

Well the bridge doctor thing may work, but with that saddle being so low and with a high action, doesn't it need a neck reset too? Plus new nut, new saddle and refret. It might work out ok. Might be a good opportunity to put a clock movement in it and hang it on a wall in the pool room.

Unless it was a kickass ax in it's day, or there's some sentimental value. Maybe a good excuse to buy a new guitar?