Red box

sampson · Post by **sampson** » Thu Apr 23, 2009 6:55 pm

Hi All
I'm very new to all this and slightly daunted but seem to have caught the bug. I find this forum very helpful so thank you. I'm wondering what red box (as I found some highly figured stuff) would be like as a tone wood and how important is 1/4 sawn for the back and sides if the timber is old and stable?
Cheers Todd

Allen · Post by **Allen** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 6:01 am

Welcome to the forum Todd.

I moved this to the main forum, as it I believe it's much more likely to be found and get a response.

I've got no experience with Red Box, but some tonewoods will work better than others if cut off the 1/4. It has to do with the amount of seasonal fluctuations in the rate of expansion and contraction of your chosen wood. Being very old may be advantageous for some of the woods characteristics, but it's not going to totally negate these seasonal movements.

DarwinStrings · Post by **DarwinStrings** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 10:39 am

G'day Todd and welcome from me too. I had a bit of a google on 'red box' and can't find much info other than it is a excellent firewood but that does not rule it out. Eucalypti are not the most stable woods around but that doesn't rule them out either. 'Cupping' will be your major concern with those backsawn boards. You may also find them difficult to bend. For cupping you could maybe saw a piece out at 2.5 mm thick then subject it to some artificial changes in humidity to see how much it moves, then make a decision from there and for bending just give it a bash and see how you go.

Jim

Kim · Post by **Kim** » Fri Apr 24, 2009 5:04 pm

Don't know about the Redbox, but welcome to the ANZLF Todd.

Cheers

Kim

sampson · Post by **sampson** » Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:23 am

Thanks guys I will get it cut and see what happens, if its no good I will throw it on da fire. Ive also just found some green blackwood how long should I leave to dry before I cut it for back and sides?
Cheers Todd

sebastiaan56 · Post by **sebastiaan56** » Sun Apr 26, 2009 12:09 pm

Hi Todd and a welcome from me as well,

The rule of thumb for air drying is 1 year per inch (25.4mm) of board thickness. Just make sure you seal the ends of the boards first and make sure the boards are seperated when you stack them for drying.

bassbuilderman · Post by **bassbuilderman** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 8:26 pm

Hi Todd,
I hope this reply is not too late. I have bought red box before, and only used it to make chopping boards. I think you may be talking about the red box at AFT in Port Melbourne. This is the stuff I bought. Highly figured. As a chopping board its great, pay around $18 per 40cm length, about 30 minutes with a router, and sell it for $140. I'm giving away trade secrets!!!

As for using it with guitars, I think you'll find it WAY TOO HEAVY for anything other than maybe a fretboard. It is pretty dense stuff, I think a cousin to ironbark (someone will probably correct me!). It sands and routs pretty well, so it might make a nice looking fingerboard, but as for a body or neck or soundplate. I'm thinking it may be best to avoid.

That's my 2Cents anyway.
Cheers
BBM

Dennis Leahy · Post by **Dennis Leahy** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:37 pm

I can't find any information on the density or specific gravity of Red Box (Eucalyptus polyanthemos), but good sounding instruments are made from a number of species with a very high density. With extremely dense material, I would think of thinning the back and sides a bit more than "usual", but I would not let that property alone stop me from using it.

Also, rather than air drying thick boards, you may find the wood resaws more easily now than it will when completely dry. Stickered, weighted, with a fan blowing gently through the stack of 3mm to 4mm boards, you can cut down the drying time considerably.

You Aussies sure have a wide array of Eulypts! A treasure trove waiting for someone to champion each species, build a few instruments, and maybe find the next great tonewood.

Dennis

Bob Connor · Post by **Bob Connor** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 9:56 pm

There's 7-800 different species down here Dennis.

J.F. Custom · Post by **J.F. Custom** » Thu Jul 30, 2009 10:11 pm

Hi Todd,

Welcome aboard. I have no personal experience with Red Box either - you will gain insight into what is 'more' likely to work on a guitar than not, through years of working with various timbers building guitars. What I will say is that, though I'm sure it burns nice and slow - don't throw it on the fire if its nicely figured! Save it for anything from binding if it bends ok, to peghead veneer to rosette details etc... There are plenty of uses for beautiful timber that might not be suitable for back and sides.

Cheers,

Jeremy.

Dennis Leahy · Post by **Dennis Leahy** » Fri Jul 31, 2009 3:04 am

bob wrote:There's 7-800 different species down here Dennis.

Knowing what you can do with hardwoods such as Mahogany, Koa, and Monkeypod as soundboards...

Could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar? Well, let me rephrase that, of course you could, but could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar that you figure in advance will probably sound "good" (again, subjective, I know)? Has anyone done it?

Dennis

Mr K · Post by **Mr K** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 1:02 am

Well I'm using some Red Box at the moment although not on guitars , To me it seems like a brittle wood more so than Red gum .
Its about 1024 kg/m3
This Board was 32mm which I re sawed down the middle.
The top board , the lower one is cinnamon wood

and this is I have used the Red Box for , these are amplifier head shells.
And the wood on the front panels is Silver ash.

The Red Box is a loverly looking timber
Cheers Mark

kiwigeo · Post by **kiwigeo** » Sat Aug 01, 2009 4:24 am

If those amp head shells dont sell to well theyd make realy nice bee hives.

Tigermyrtle · Post by **Tigermyrtle** » Tue Aug 04, 2009 10:14 pm

Hi Dennis, Rick Turner built a Eucalyptus Mandolin so I dont see why you could not build a guitar including the soundboard.
Cheers Bob

Dennis Leahy wrote:
bob wrote:There's 7-800 different species down here Dennis.
Knowing what you can do with hardwoods such as Mahogany, Koa, and Monkeypod as soundboards...

Could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar? Well, let me rephrase that, of course you could, but could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar that you figure in advance will probably sound "good" (again, subjective, I know)? Has anyone done it?

Dennis

Bob Connor · Post by **Bob Connor** » Wed Aug 05, 2009 10:01 pm

Dennis Leahy wrote:
bob wrote:There's 7-800 different species down here Dennis.
Knowing what you can do with hardwoods such as Mahogany, Koa, and Monkeypod as soundboards...

Could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar? Well, let me rephrase that, of course you could, but could you build an All-Eucalypt guitar that you figure in advance will probably sound "good" (again, subjective, I know)? Has anyone done it?

Dennis

Dennis

I've got some Tas Oak that I got on a trip to Tassie recently that is the same weight as most of my Engelmann Spruce. ie it is light. I've got a top jointed already from this timber so, yes, I do think this will work for a top.

However mostly it is a little too heavy for tops but make great back and sides.

Need to take each piece on it's merits. But I know you know this already

Jack Spira has been using it for necks recently. He had a Vic Ash necked guitar at a show I was at earlier in the year.

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